DIY, Toid’s Klipsch KPT-325 inspired VS JTR 212 inspired

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      • January 31, 2024 at 10:52 am #52785

        Hello everyone!

        I’m new here and I wanted to ask some questions that I came across now that I want to upgrade my front stage (3 identical speakers for Home Theater and Music)

        First option is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNO_ddqOYrw&t=187s ,

        whereas the second option is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bgmQajxsYY .

        I’ve read every single comment on Toid’s Youtube on those 2 videos and I wonder which speaker design out of those two would be best (especially when it comes to providing massive amounts of output, because I usually turn my speakers to the side facing out to my garden when throwing a party with friends).

        Is there a way to have the exact “stats” of those 2 sets of speakers, like “Maximum SPL@1meter”, mean sensitivity, and of course how low can they dig? I’m guessing that the woofer’s specs change when they get inside a box ported/sealed etc.

        I’d appreciate any help (keep in mind that I’m a newbie when it comes to all this)

        • February 7, 2024 at 1:54 am #52835

          I built 3 of the Audience 212 for my home theater LCR and am very happy with them. Great speakers. Sorry, cannot provide any comparison info but will surely vouch for Audience 212.

          My next build will be a couple of SoundStage 15 speakers that will primarily be used for music listening. Perhaps, looking at them too may not be a bad idea, before making a final decision. These speakers are some of the best that you can build using Toid’s plans: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLDqPDDFEdQ&ab_channel=ToidsDIYAudio

          Being a first time DIY-er, I was not sure about the build process too but after building a 7.2.5 home theater system myself, I can say that building speakers is not a complex process. You can always post your questions/concerns here in the forum.

          Good luck!

            • February 8, 2024 at 7:33 am #52844

              I’m sure you won’t be disappointed with the Soundstages.

              I’m currently only running 2 in my living room in full range off of an Onkyo receiver, and they are REALLY great, even without subs. For movies, they lack a bit of I don’t use the subs, but for music they are everything I want and more

              • February 9, 2024 at 4:01 pm #52873

                Awesome. Thanks for the feedback. I talked to Nick about Soundstage 15 some time ago and he had the same opinion. I will create a forum thread of my build once I get to it. Who knows, I may build SoundStage 215 ๐Ÿ™‚๐Ÿ‘

                • February 9, 2024 at 6:04 pm #52876

                  If you want to build a so called soundstage 215 dont do it without reaching out to me first

                  I don’t think you had joined the forum when I designed it (and the thread seems to have been lost in the forum move) but I have my own plans with detailed build guide, cut lists etc available for a 3 way (2 way active/dsp crossover) bi amped tower based on the SS15 combined with a dayton MX15-22. The MX15-22 does 19hz-65hz on its own amp channel then the SS15 does 65hz-20khz as per Nick’s orignal passive crossover design on the second amp channel

                  CAD render atttached to demonstrate

                  • February 9, 2024 at 9:58 pm #52882

                    That looks GLORIOUS, and I’m very interested.

                    Are the dimensions of the upper chamber identical to the original SS15? If so, would it be possible to get the build out for only the bottom sub chamber?

                    The wife and I have really fallen in love with the look of having massive, duratex coated speakers in the living room. So much so that she’s agreed to a long-term goal of building massive 21″ multisub towers eventually

                    • February 10, 2024 at 7:47 pm #52902

                      After @Chedwin replies back, you have to tell us where to find such women ๐Ÿ˜€

                      • February 10, 2024 at 9:16 pm #52907

                        Indeed they are. I designed this in a way that I am only augmenting what Nick has already designed and made sure not to infringe on his IP. I dont have all the details for the SS15 forcing anyone who builds mine to also have to buy the orginal SS15 plans

                        Building out just the lower sub sections on its own may work but you will notice that although I didnt change the dimmentions or driver spacing of the SS15 I did invert the drivers vs the port location, changed the bracing layout to account for the vibrations through the entire tower and it may be hard to see in the CAD model but the boundary between the 2 chambers is a doubled up layer of wood again to tame the overall tower vibrations/resonances. The side of tower is a single L shaped piece and the bracing layout and general internal structure is designed to damp the enitre side piece as a whole from both 15โ€ drivers at the same time

                        I am not entirely sure how the lower chamber work work as a standalone sub due to the small but important changes I made. They are designed as a true full range 3 way tower not to act like separate main and subwoofer of a more typical 2.1 or 5.1 etc.

                        If you just want to add a low end cabinet to your existing setup something more along the lines of Nicks subwoofer build using the same MX15-22 may be better suited

                        • February 10, 2024 at 7:58 pm #52903

                          Josh,

                          That speaker looks really cool. A true full range speaker that won’t require separate subs! I love the design but it looks like a CNC machine might be more suited for the cut list? I am still waiting for the DIY kit for the Maslow CNC to be widely available for purchase. I will surely contact you, thanks. Might not be a bad idea to resurrect that thread here.

                          https://toidsdiyaudio.com/forums/discussion/affordable-large-format-cnc/

                          • February 10, 2024 at 9:08 pm #52905

                            It can be (and has been) easily built with a tablesaw or jigsaw, a standard router and a steady hand.

                            The cut lists just shows the most efficient way to get all the parts out of full 8×4 sheets of material but is intended for marking out with pencil and hand cutting, no CNC cut paths are included with the design

                            • February 10, 2024 at 9:43 pm #52915

                              Having issues posting from my PC atm, can only post from my phone, so donโ€™t have the better picture to show but the bracing is a lot simpler to cut and assemble than it appears in the completed design

                              Itโ€™s made of simple flat pieces with sections cut away then the piece are glued together flat surface to flat surface. No complex or precision tolerance cuts required

                              • February 10, 2024 at 9:58 pm #52918

                                did this work?

                                • February 13, 2024 at 2:23 am #52929

                                  Yes it did!

                                  The bracing did look like it needed very precise cutting but I will take your words for it. If there is a way to resurrect your thread on these speakers here in the new forum, I would love to check it out.

                                  This speaker build sounds so tempting ๐Ÿ˜€ Good thing, the subwoofer driver is out of stock on Parts Express!

                                  • February 13, 2024 at 3:26 am #52930

                                    The bracing sections just need to be accurate for the outer dimensions which are simple straight cuts made when the pieces are still 4 sided. The cut aways are just to remove material in a strategic pattern to end up with the correct internal air volume whilst also bracing the outer shell. Whilst the shape and spacing of the patterns is calculated there is enough room for some hand tool tolerance so if the curves are not perfect it doesnโ€™t matter than much as long as the relevant flat edges all make good contact along the glue joints. This will make more sense if/when you see the build guide, I promise ๐Ÿ˜†

                                    The original thread was mainly made up of posts from the guy I designed these for showing his build process and working through some decisions with us so I donโ€™t have the content to restore all that myself. That said if I find the time I will do a proper post about them explaining the concept behind them, the changes I made to the original SS15 design and why I made the all the specific choices I did

                                    • February 14, 2024 at 6:36 pm #52957

                                      Strange! My previous reply disappeared. Lets try again!

                                      I think it would be awesome if you are able to resurrect the build thread. I would even go to the extent of making the build plan available for purchase here! A full range SoundStage 15 speaker sounds great.

                                      • February 14, 2024 at 7:21 pm #52958

                                        I need to go through a couple of outdoor freespace measurement steps with 1 or 2 more completed builders first (i do not have the space to build 1 myself here and test it) so I can finese the DSP configuration sheet and the guide needs some cleanup work before releasing it to a wider audience than one-on-one DM supported build processes but I have already toyed with the idea of getting it on the store for sale

                                      • February 7, 2024 at 5:05 pm #52839

                                        Both speaker options will work great as a front stage but if you will also be using them to throw sound out to the garden for parties I’d suggest going with the BTS-15. They have a lower crossover point between compression driver and woofer of 800hz vs the audience 212 around 1300hz so more of the mid frequency information is guided by the horn with more efficienet power handling behind it. This will make a big difference when throwing sound further and to cover a larger area than just targeting the near field main listening position. Alot more of the frequency range will be guided and focused by the horn reducing the amount of acoustic energy lost to off axis radiation bouncing around the room

                                        In the mixing of music content we have a kind of unwritten guideline that 90% of the detail and instrument separation occurs in the mid range with the highs and lows adding extra flair and excitement to a mix, get the mid range mixed right and the clarity of the mix should translate to most playback systems. I also carry the same concept over to the playback reproduction side of it when designing and deploying large PA systems for theatres, bars, clubs etc. The better you can cover your audince area with clean and consistent mid range the more the audience/guests will (subconsciously) enjoy the experience as they have to put in less mental effort to be able to understand what they are hearing. Low end coverage is close second to mid range for me when it comes to the audience playback side and both speakers options will handle the low end no problem

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