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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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So this forum has really rekindled my interest in design of loudspeakers. In the years since I've started (a LONG time ago), I've learned a lot, done a lot, dreamed a lot. 

One of the things I've done is to take the information learned and translate it into BASIC. Yes, that old DOS beast that does weird and wonderful stuff . Everything has been text based so far, and I don't have any plans to incorporate graphics currently, but I would like to do a big redesign of all the small individual programs all into one. A new interface, easier jumps and edits, file IO, and plain .txt output that can be sent to any printer (I never really got into graphics). I also plan to build in more input to check the manufacturer's numbers, since many of the specs are mathematically derived from just a few parameters.

If you've seen some of the previous threads, you can see that the basics of my calcs are pretty much what WinISD puts out, so you can be sure of it's accuracy. 

What I would like from any of the members out there is for a .txt file from the other programs (WinISD, BassBox, etc.) that shows how they store the parameters for the drivers. Just the .txt file and a screenshot showing the order of the information.

I'm pretty sure I'll be the only one who would want to use it, but I thought I'd put it out there for freeware to the Forum. I'm an older user who remembers when there weren't any personal computers and having a calculator was a rare privilege. It's one of my few indulgences.

Thanks to all.

If there's enough interest, I could translate it into Excel. Of course, that'd be after I get the BASIC version complete.

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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Kevin Kendrick
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Hi Charlie, not sure if this will help but thought I would offer. Admitedly, I'm a "BassBox" guy, but not convinced it's as good as it gets when it comes to box modeling. Would like to see some comparisons, measured comparisons. If that's something you had in mind, I'd be glad to work with you on this. Bassbox has it's "Pro's", can't imagine a more user friendly program, but one of the "Con's" is it's not freeware. For some of the guys just getting into the hobby, freeware makes it easier to get started and leaves some extra cash in the pockets for other things.

You requested a text file, but BassBox doesn't show an option for exporting driver parameters that way (if it does, I'm not seeing it). There's a database with thousands of saved drivers, along with the ability to add new drivers and manufacturers. The order of hierarchy is Manufacturer first and all driver models belonging to that Manufacturer under that. The basic parameter screen looks like the one I've attached. You'll notice colored dots to the left of some of the parameters, (green, yellow, or red).  If one of the parameters is too far out of the norm, it will cause issues with others. Any time I've used DATs to get the basic driver parameters, everything else usually checks out once it's input into BassBox.  The attachment is of the SB Acoustics 4" ceramic woofer, model SB12CACS25-4.

SB12CACS25 04

 

 


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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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@kevin-kendrick

Hmm. Well, I'll just go along and see what I can do in this old-school venture. That screen shot should help. At least I have an idea how to approach it from that.

I have no problem sharing my work if it can help someone go into the hobby in an easier way. Yeah, it may need something like DOSBox to run, but that's free too. I do plan to have the results printed / saved to a standard ASCII text file that will have all the important info and maybe a "text graphic" showing a box with the dimensions on it.

WINISD is free too, I might download it to see how it works as well.

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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123Toid
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@tvor-ceasar

I have had great success with WinISD.  In fact, it is still the only box modeling software I use.  In my experience, if your measurements are good, then you will get a fairly accurate response with winISD.  I have never used BassBox Pro, but I want to try it out sometime to see if it is actually worth the price difference.  I know, I have said for me the Omnimic made the price difference, but for most people it wouldn't be worth it.  I wonder if that would be the same with Bassbox pro...

https://www.youtube.com/123toid


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Kevin Kendrick
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It seems WinISD is the homerun for box modeling when it comes to freeware, most of the guys I know in the hobby use it. When getting started, I decided to purchase BassBox after seeing all of Part's Express's recommended enclosure suggestions were done using it. Is it any better (or worse) than WinISD, not sure, have never heard anyone directly compare them. Think I'll download WinISD and play around with it some too, might be interesting. Good luck on the new software Charlie, I'll be following along to see how it works out for you. 


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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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How's this for an old school Splash Screen?

 

Speaker Designer Splash

I'm not sold on the name. It's a placeholder for the moment. I really would like to incorporate DOS and/or BAS into the name, but there are 2 programs that could be really confused with those particular TLAs.

Plus, I know it needs to come down at least one line and I really need to re-aquaint myself with the extended ASCII code, but you should hear the intro. Straight from the example. 😁

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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Kevin Kendrick
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@tvor-ceasar

It certainly has the "Old School" look Charlie. 🙂 


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TVOR-Ceasar
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Update - This time a video. Fairly happy with the Splash and now beginning the Driver Input area.

Yes, there's sound.

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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TVOR-Ceasar
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Less annoying Splash screen. Same as before, different audio. Sorry about the shaky camera, but it's handheld across a desk.

 

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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TVOR-Ceasar
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Wrote a small routine that takes the calculated FB and F3 and converts them to tones (within the limitations of QBasic) so you can get an idea of those hallmarks. Here ya go:

LET FB1 = FIX(Y)
LET F31 = FIX(X)
IF Y <= FB1 + .4999 THEN FB2 = FB1 ELSE FB2 = FB1 + 1
IF X <= F31 + .4999 THEN F32 = F31 ELSE F32 = F31 + 1
IF FB2 >= 37 THEN PRINT "PLAYING FB"; FB2
IF FB2 >= 37 THEN SOUND INT(FB2), 40 ELSE PRINT "FB below 37 Hz, cannot play that low"
IF F32 >= 37 THEN PRINT "PLAYING F3"; F32
IF F32 >= 37 THEN SOUND INT(F32), 40 ELSE PRINT "F3 below 37 Hz, cannot play that low"

In this particular case, Y =FB (calculated) and X = F3 (calculated), both of which "can" have several places past the decimal. This routine "rounds" them up or down, then checks to see if they can be played down to the lowest limit of "raw" Qbasic, which is 37 Hz.

It could get annoying if you had to listen to a lot of that, so it'll be optional. I thought it might be nice to have it available.

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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123Toid
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@tvor-ceasar

For future reference, there is a great program called sharex.  It is a free screen capture software.  It has helped me out a lot.  Awesome job on the program! 

https://www.youtube.com/123toid


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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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I have CamStudio on  the Laptop or the Tablet, not on this desktop. Must remedy that situation. Not sure if it does audio, but that's easy enough to dub.

I like using the desktop for most of the "putzing around" stuff with full size keyboard and mouse and real speakers. So much better sounding than the tiny little built-ins in the other ones. They make it sound just like the 8-bit it really is.

If that doesn't work out, I'll try Sharex. Thanks!

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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Here's a test of 2 different drivers, just to show what the snippet will do.

Here's the screen cap because the conversion to MP4 is crappy. The forum doesn't like WMV. Time for some actual software.

Gento 2 PRV 4

 In case you wanted to know, the frequencies are 128, 86, 53 and 40

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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TVOR-Ceasar
(@tvor-ceasar)
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Quick update.

I put this on temporary hold - I still intend to finish it. In the meantime, I am putting together a Quick Evaluation Program to help run through drivers to see what you like without inputting all kinds of parameters if you aren't sure of the driver's possibilities. 

Note: I am working in QBasic (Need Windows/DOSBox or similar emulator) and everything I have previously written is in Imperial units (inches & Cu.Ft.), of which you will need to use decimal form. If your driver has Metric measurements, use the calculator on your computer or phone, they have built in convertors, you just have to explore them to find them.

The important info you'll need are:
<Driver Info>
Driver size
Fs
Qts
Vas
<Box Info>
New or Old box
Wall Thickness
Sealed - Qcab
Ported - Port Diameter
Transmission Line - nothing needed
Band Pass - Low End Cutoff and Duct Diameter

Yes, there will be times when certain types won't be feasible, but this will allow you to compare these 4 basic types quickly. In other threads, I have noted how quickly this can make evaluating a driver, And I want to be able to share this with everyone. If even 1 person finds it useful, it is worth it to me.

I'll keep you posted.

-Charlie
https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueVoiceOfReason


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ajc9988
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@tvor-ceasar - I take it you are not a java coder? I can't code at all, but I did think about using a combination of java and git on windows to do similar to what is done for bots buying hardware (or like nvidia-snatcher now called street merchant by Jef).

Basically, by using the same process of a headless browser, you could have it dial up the speaker section on Parts-Express, then have it scrape speaker data on the page, dump it into a text file in a format similar to .wdr, which is the following:

[Driver]
Brand=.Kartesian
Model=Lom120_vPA
Manufacturer=.Kartesian
ProvidedBy=ajc9988
Comment=Small impedence bump around 2000, large one around 4800; no off axis separation until 2000; around 89dB, 87 around 340-400, 92 from 1500-1800¤
DateAdded=20210313
DateModified=20210313
Qts=0.386
Znom=8
Fs=120
Pe=0
SPL=90
Re=6.3
Le=0
fLe=0
KLe=0
BL=8.7
Xmax=0.003
Cms=0.000319280814720421
Qms=7.12
Qes=0.409176567067315
Rms=0.58342638918922
Mms=0.00652
Sd=0.00554
Vas=0.00117
Dia=0
Vd=0.00001662
no=0.00474424472380554
Dd=0.0839865886783884
EBP=293.271926249527
numVC=1
Hc=0
Hg=0
SPLmax=0
SPLmaxLF=63.4062345792487
USPL=91.04232321595
alfaVC=0
Rt=0
Ct=0
gamma=1334.35582822086
Rme=12.0142857142857
Mpow=3.46616296706974
Mcost=0
Gloss=0.00575012375906326
VCCon=1
c=345.146785515037
roo=1.00227256651609
Thick=0.005
Depth=0.0629
MagDepth=0.027
Magnet=0.0547
Basket=0.1004
Outer=0.12
Vcd=0.034
DVol=0.000167447736727885
ParState=EENEENNNEEECECECEECENCCENNNCCNNNCCCCNCEEEEEEECNCC

After it is dumped into a text file, it is easily switched to a *.wdr file and able to be added into WinISD. This doesn't help to narrow down the driver to use, but it can help to massively add speakers to WinISD by adapting it to scrape the info from specific vendor's sites. Just a random musing.

Also, I do not vouch for the veracity of the dimensions or the accuracy of my data entry in the above example.

Edit: and a better example of comments to myself from reviewing the FR charts (from TWT28_vHP) -
Comment=Smooth impedance; could start around 2000Hz, off axis starts to diverge around 3000, splits off 60 deg at 8000Hz, 6dB by 10,000 and almost 12db lower by 20,000, 30 deg splits at 9000, 3dB from 10,000 to 15000, 6dB after that¤


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