Blog Forums DIY Speakers and Subwoofers Audi A5 – Subwoofer Upgrade

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    • #11191
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Hello Gents,

      I have  Audi A5 and the Subwoofer is absolutely appalling and needs replacing.

      Currently this is the subwoofer that is installed. Its using my interior as a IB system as the magnet of the subwoofer faces up into the cabin.

       


      So as I have discussed with Toid, We can fit any 10 inch subwoofer into that shelf magnet into the boot.

      The cars boot is 465 Liters of Air according to the book.

      Im not looking for crazy bass just this sub seems to make horrible noises on certan tracks.

      I was planning on just sticking a 10 inch sub into it magnet down into the boot and using a amp to boost the signal from the existing subwoofer connections.

       

      Some people have done this


       

      As you can see he fitted a 10 inch fine and matted it out.

       

      Toid told me 

       

      You have sound waves coming both on the front and rear of the subwoofer. Most people don’t think of it like that, but typically you’re going to get better sound with it firing up into the cabin versus firing into the Trunk. So the way it’s mounted right now, isn’t ideal.”

       

      Also that high Xmax and low FS and a good QTS would be ideal.

       

      Add in the fact that your trunk isn’t really a full infinite baffle. It’s just a big sealed box helps as well

      Other comments 

       

      It is. It is still considered an infinite baffle. But what I’m talking about is like putting a subwoofer on the other side of a wall and using the rest of your house as the box. That would take a little bit more then the particular case that you’re using it in. X max is just the amount of movement the cone can move from the voice coil. So it has oh really generous amount of movement, which is needed when you don’t have the compression of the box

       

      Toid reccomended a few subs but there in the usa.

       

      I can only buy them from UK sites. such as http://www.caraudiocentre.co.uk ebay.co.uk and caraudiodirect.co.uk or anything like that.

       

      Please can somone reccomend me a subwoofer? and a Amp?

       

      Thanks for your time!

       

       

       

    • #11196
      123toid
      Keymaster

      It looks like Ground Zero’s titanium sub woofers are designed for free air operation.  It also looks liek this would work as well: http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/subwoofers/10-inch-subs-25cm/ground-zero-iridium-gziw-10spl-subwoofer-10-inch-700w-dvc-2-ohms  I have not simulated it yet, but can if you have any interest in it. I don’t know anything about this brand, so I have no idea how honest their numbers are. Are you not able to buy from sound imports?


    • #11197
      123toid
      Keymaster
    • #11198
      123toid
      Keymaster

      You are typically looking for a subwoofer that can handle a lot of RMS power, high excursion and a high qts (over 0.6).  These are all rules of thumb.  


    • #11205
      v6thomas
      Participant

      I think I might manage to use sound imports. I dont mind mate whatever you thinks good choose I will go for. Can u recommend a amp too ?

    • #11206
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Ground zero dose look good tbh.

      Can you recommend a amp and run a simulation to check if that will work.

       

      I will buy you a beer lol

    • #11213
      123toid
      Keymaster

      @v6thomas

      It looks like Groudn Zero used some creative marketing to askew their numbers.  Everywhere you look it has an z-max of 25mm.  However, if you dig deeper, you see it’s one way xmax is only 11mm. It will still work, but with less power.  You would want a 200w RMS amplifier with a subsonic/infrasonic filter around 20-28hz.  This will still give you a max spl of around 104.  The only amplifier I could really see was this one. http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/amplifiers/mono-amplifiers/vibe-powerbox-500-1-v7-1000w-class-d-mono-channel-car-subwoofer-amplifier  In America, we also have the Rockford Fosgate R2-250X1, which has a variable infrasonic filter.  I only saw the older model on your site (R250x1) which I could not find any mention of an infrasonic filter. 


    • #11215
      123toid
      Keymaster

      It looks like this would work as well.  I would mention, do not use the bass boost with any of these amplifiers. https://www.caraudiocentre.co.uk/product_m-phoenix-gold-audio-rx2250-1_p-42049.htm

      You could also get a much higher rated amplfier and turn the gain down.  If you aren’t sure how to set the gain, check this out by @diy-audio-guy

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBcGOoRJ4Ro

       


    • #11222
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Toid,

       

      I think I can use sound imports. Can you suggest the best options on that site.

      If I cant I will revert back to the other options but lets try sound imports.

       

      Thanks for the help so far!

      Sooner I can order the better

    • #11223
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Also, I thought if you buy a 700w sub you needed a 700w amp?
      Probably because I’m new to this kind of thing and I’m probably very wrong lol. But can you enlighten me?

    • #11237
      123toid
      Keymaster

      @v6thomas

      I mean I would personally use the 10 in ultimax from sound imports. if you can do that, that would be a better choice. 

      As far as amplifier power goes, that’s a common misconception. People just assume that if it says 700 Watts RMS, it can take 700 Watts. And although that true… It really is false. What I mean to say is, depending on the box that you put it in the driver will hit its mechanical limits before that 700 Watts RMS. So the amount of wattage a subwoofer can take is dependent upon the box that you put it in.


    • #11238
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @123toid thanks toid

       

      Can you link me the amp and sub incase I mess it up

    • #11239
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @123toid

       

      Ahh that’s out my budget abit tbh 

      Any thing else that would work?

    • #11240
      123toid
      Keymaster

      @v6thomas

      sub: http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/subwoofers/10-inch-subs-25cm/ground-zero-iridium-gziw-10spl-subwoofer-10-inch-700w-dvc-2-ohms

      amp: https://www.caraudiocentre.co.uk/product_m-phoenix-gold-audio-rx2250-1_p-42049.htm

      You can go with a higher power amplifier if you want, just set your gain appropriately.  This is definitely on the lower side for power. 


    • #11251
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Any suggestion of wire gauges and stuff?

    • #11264
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas 

      4 gauge will work up to around 1500watts rms. Make sure it’s ofc and not copper clad aluminum. 2/0 welding wire will work too. Not quite as flexible as the car audio stuff though. Make sure to fuse the power wire at the battery with a good solid chassis ground near the amp. 
      I did look at the amps on your link. Didn’t really see too many I wouldn’t buy. The infinity and jbl (Harmon Cardon) are great for the price have a couple of them myself. If room is an issue I’d get the Rockford fosgate t750. It’s a beastly little amp and dynos close to 1000 watts rms @2 and 1 ohm.  
      the jl stuff is high quality but pricey. Kinda comes down to diminishing returns once ya get to a certain price point imo. 

    • #11297
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Gents,

       

      Please see video the items are here! need minor advice pleaseeeeee

       

      https://youtu.be/fJkPHeaNhh4

       

    • #11298
      oneway
      Member

      I’m not familiar with that amp or sub as they’re not popular or not available in the states. It looks like it has high level inputs so you can use the signal from the factory sub (ie speaker wires) to the new amp. The issue you may run into is  some cars have factory equalization or bass roll off just depends on the car/factory system. Best fix for that would be a dsp with de equalization. Hopefully that’s not the case and you have a good signal. 

      using high level inputs you wouldn’t use the rca inputs. The rca outputs are for sending a signal to another amp. 

      remote turn on is a 12 volt signal that will trigger the amplifier to turn on. You could put a switch on it too so you could turn the amp off anytime you’re not using the stereo while driving. 

      the remote knob is probably a level control. Hopefully it’s designed not to go any higher than your gain setting or isn’t a remote for bass boost. Personally I only install them if they are a level control 

      I suggest not using any bass boost if the amp has bass boost. Just turn it off or all the way down. It only causes the amp to go into clipping sooner. It’s basically a 1 band eq usually centered around 45hz. If really feel like you need it you’ll want to set your gain with the amount of boost you’re going to use. 

      when you set the gain you need to set it at the max volume of your head unit before it gets to distortion (ie clipping)

      it is usually around 3/4 volume on factory systems. Simple way to find is play one of your loudest songs you’re familiar with and turn it up till it starts to distort then turn it back down a notch or two to where it sounds good again. That’ll be your max volume set the gain on your sub at that volume 
      you may get a little more volume from music that’s recorded at a lower dB level. You just have to use your head and pay attention to distortion.

       

      after you get where you think you have the gain set play your loud song again at the max volume you have determined isn’t distorting plus another song or two listening for distortion or sub bottoming out or anything that doesn’t sound natural then if all good check the sub for heat. It shouldn’t be hot or very warm at all. Basically around room temp. Check amp and make sure it isn’t unusually hot. Should be warm shouldn’t feel like it’ll fry eggs   

       
      there should be a manual with the amplifier as well 

    • #11299
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @oneway

       

      Thanks a lot mate,

       

      With regards to the subwoofer wiring? It has a + and – on each side?

       

       

    • #11300
      oneway
      Member

      Sounds like single voice coil. Send a link of the one you have,if you can. 

    • #11301
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas ok just seen you said each side. Need to know what ohm load each coil is and what ohm load amp can go do to. Most likely either 1 or 2 ohms. 

    • #11302
      v6thomas
      Participant

      1010-Scan-28-Apr-2020.pdf

       

      Please see attached document with speaker and my amp one

      1011-Scan-28-Apr-2020-1.pdf

       

    • #11303
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas ok from what I could see it’s a dual 2 ohm sub and amp is 500 watts at a 1 ohm load so you’re going to want to wire the sub parallel so the amp will see a 1 ohm load. 

      in reality it won’t see a 1 ohm load often or at all due to impedance rise but that’s another topic 

      take a short piece of speaker wire and connect it to one of the positive terminals on the sub and run it to the other positive terminal and do the same for the negatives. Then out of one of the terminals wire it to the amp like the picture shows for one sub. 
      You can always double check the ohm load is correct with a digital multimeter. Should read close to one ohm once you’ve wired sub parallel. 

      another option is to wire each coil to the amplifiers speaker terminals. Positive to positive negative to negative. Like pic shows for two subs. 

    • #11304
      v6thomas
      Participant

      It’s a 1000w one mate 

       

      https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/173311607608

       

      Its model 500 I think but states 1000w

    • #11305
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas yeah that’s max ratings. Never go by max ratings it means absolutely nothing you always want to go by rms ratings. Max ratings are for sales advertisements. 
      Also watch out for products that seem too good to be true. Over rating is a thing. For instance  Super cheap amps that claim a lot of power typically get nowhere close 

    • #11306
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @oneway

       

      Ahh okay mate. Toid recommended this amp back at the start of the thread so I trusted the expertise I dont know enough but I do find it interesting. If this does well mabe upgrade the other speakers in the car…. if you guys are up for holding my hand through it haha 

    • #11359
      v6thomas
      Participant

      Hello Gents,

       

      So far I installed the Subwoofer and AMP.

      I got the signal from the old Sub Cables.

      I even tested the old sub directly on my subwoofer to see how it came out so here it is.

      https://youtu.be/_ehKSGQB-38

       

      Since I hooked the AMP up and see here

      https://youtu.be/jKxjT4uEh4E

       

      So a few issues. I set everything to 0

      I set everything to 0 and started trying to set my gain etc.

      So main issue here is that If i turn my gain to max nothing happens unless i play with the LPF

      So a friend of mine told me to set Gain to middle etc and then alter the LPF until the sub engages.

      And I did that. Then I tried setting gain. The gain don’t do hardly anything and the only way I can get any bass like in the video is with the Bass Boost on!

      So I connected the amp like this

      The Subwoofer is running in paralell like so

      I got my Input from the old sub cables. The White/Yellow was my Positive. And I think the other wire was Brown/Yellow and was my ground. I took these into the High-Level Input of my AMP and on my AMP I don’t need to use a signal wire to turn it on it can detect via the High-Level Input.

       

      I used 4gauge wire to hook the battery to the amp and ground to the car chassies.

       

      I cant get any decent bass out of her without bass booster,

      I need some serious guidance 

       

       

       

       

    • #11360
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas the gain is for signal level matching. Once you’ve matched it with the input signal it will do no good to keep turning it up and will cause clipping once you’ve passed matching it it’ll distort before you reach your head units max volume 

      haven’t had a chance to listen to video as I’m not near a stereo 

      My experience with infinite baffle is 0 but pretty sure it needs to be completely sealed off from the front of the baffle (deck in your case) to the back of it.  Was this just a replacement sub?  If so is the sub sealed well to the baffle? An air leak can cause poor output 

       
      what was it a single 8” infinite baffle? If so I wouldn’t expect a lot of bass but what is the lpf set at and does the amp have a subsonic or high pass filter 

    • #11361
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @oneway

       

      Was a 10 inch and it did make bass. The issue was it rattled a lot and the bass was low but obviously there.

       

      This is a huge improvement but I cant get anything with just the gain no matter how high volume and bassline is in the car.

       

      I maxed the car volume to my highest listening and when I turn up gain nothing but if I turn up gain and bass boost I get bass.

       

      Something is defiantly amiss here mate 

    • #11362
      oneway
      Member

      @v6thomas difficult to troubleshoot on the internet. Kinda sounds like a weak signal. Possibly car has factory bass roll off I don’t know.
      Integration with factory head units can be difficult depending on vehicle. If there’s a form for your car I’d look there see if maybe someone can help you with your install. 

      Other than double checking your sub wiring with a digital multimeter to make sure you’re wired correctly and sub has a good  mounting seal you can check the ac voltage at the speaker terminals on the amp and see if voltage climbs as you turn up the volume or levels off way before you get to max listening level 

      low pass filter set to around 80hz turn subsonic all the way to the left is a good starting point. If sub is wired correctly and you have a good signal  you should have plenty of bass without bass boost. It all starts with the source signal. Poor source signal you’ll be chasing your tail trying to find issue 

    • #11363
      v6thomas
      Participant

      @oneway

       

      If you check this vid mate I connected 1 voice coil directly to the source signal cables (The cables that went to the last subwoofer) https://youtu.be/_ehKSGQB-38

       

      It can power the subwoofer kind of low but surely enough there for a signal?

      Could I check the signal with a multimeter somehow?

    • #11364
      v6thomas
      Participant

      I found a guy on this forum https://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/370286-B8-Aftermarket-Sound-System-Pictures

       

      “As for wiring, I used the existing sub wiring (stock sub is disabled), and used a PAC line-level driver to convert to RCA, then powering the sub with an Alpine PDX 1.600 and have a PAC volume control. (The little knob on the console)”

       

      Do I need this device? https://www.amazon.co.uk/Stereo-Converter-Subwoofer-Amplifier-Adapter/dp/B07S8TGT37/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=line+level+converter&qid=1589153200&refinements=p_76%3A419158031&rnid=419157031&rps=1&sr=8-1

      Also found this guy mentioning this 

       

      “Another issue could be your crossover settings. The Audi subwoofer wire you tapped into and already has been filtered as to send a narrow range of low frequencies to the factory sub. Play around with the amps imput level compensation knob so you never see the imputs clipping. Second, set the amps crossover so the subsonic filter sits around 40hz and the low pass (which prevents your sub from becoming a mid range speaker) at probably 60-70hz. If you were running a 12” sub, i’d recommend starting off at 30hz on the sub x-over and on the low-pass, around 60hz. Setting the subsonic filter too low and the low pass too high will make the amp run super hot, sound like crap, and not have much punch.

      Also, I’m assuming you have the positive wire coming from your sub plugged into the far right terminal and the negative in the far left terminal, leaving the two spots in the middle open? If you plugged it in any other way, your sub will run in either a very weak 4ohm…. or worse, 8ohm if you used the far right positive and the right negative.”

      or something like this? https://www.amazon.co.uk/Mr-Ho-2-Channel-Converter-Adjustable-Subwoofer/dp/B07GQQ5TFX/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=line+output+converter&qid=1589153911&sr=8-2

       

      I think the Stock sub was rounded off from certain frequency’s to avoid distortion.

      god this is difficult! 

       

       

       

       

       

    • #11365
      oneway
      Member

      You need a dsp with de equalization capability to properly fix the factory signal 

      your link didn’t work. 

    • #11374
      123toid
      Keymaster

      @v6thomas

      Sorry I am a little late to the party.  Something does not sound right at all. There might be an issue with the new amplifier.  Did your old amplifier have this issue?  Have you disabled the factory amplifier for the subwoofer?  I am trying to understand exactly how you wired it up. 


    • #11376
      oneway
      Member

      Best I can tell he tapped into the factory sub  and is getting a limited signal because of the factory crossover   Common problem  with a lot of late model vehicles. A audiocontrol lci with accubass can help restore the signal or a dsp that has de-equalization capabilities. 
      I am not sure exactly what’s going on seems like some new equipment has made its way in than originally discussed and some of the post are a little hard to decipher so a bit of a guess but one of the last post says “the subwoofer wire you tapped into has already been filtered”. 

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